They sure do suck. Hopefully; you can get some satisfaction from these crooks.
Fed Mandated Gov PUI regulator
- Thread starter jerw
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if credit card contest it. the plumber can charge what they want, but in a lot places it is fraud to charge for something that ain't there. actually the charge sounds reasonable to me, but what do i know? this is why i don't itemize dones or do water heaters. breid
jerw, maybe the best strategy is to contact the installer and tell them that the PUI regulator has failed. When they come out to service it you can see exactly what you were charged for and maybe get the "service" as well as the "PUI" regulator on video. As long as they don't charge you for the visit, you may be able to teach us all exactly what a PUI regulator is and why the federal govt. is mandating them.
Well if I don't hear from Home Depot soon, Someone may be walking around with a PUI regulator stuffed somewhere for Xmas. Even if it turns out to be a PSI regulator, it's going to be uncomfortable walking for someone. BUT they will be glad it wasn't a vacumn.
The charge is on my Home Depot card so I guess you could say I am disputing it by dealing with Home Depot. Time to put a little more pressure on them I guess. They've been good so far but I'm still getting nowhere on what this $258 charge is actually for. PUI or PSI there was not one installed unless of course it's one of those new "invisible" models. GEEZ, all I'm asking is for them to explain to me what exactly that $258 fee is for, how hard can that be??
And approximately $575 for installation of a 40 gal electric water heater does seem to be a bit high considering that didn't include the cost of the water heater. I've yet to find one person who thought this was a reasonable installation fee.
The charge is on my Home Depot card so I guess you could say I am disputing it by dealing with Home Depot. Time to put a little more pressure on them I guess. They've been good so far but I'm still getting nowhere on what this $258 charge is actually for. PUI or PSI there was not one installed unless of course it's one of those new "invisible" models. GEEZ, all I'm asking is for them to explain to me what exactly that $258 fee is for, how hard can that be??
And approximately $575 for installation of a 40 gal electric water heater does seem to be a bit high considering that didn't include the cost of the water heater. I've yet to find one person who thought this was a reasonable installation fee.
I installed a water heater for my neighbor who isn't real handy. I wish I could have gotten over $500.00 for that. If I could, I'de be going after my Plumbers license. Just like the Plumber who used to be a Doctor. Said he could make more money doing Plumbing.
Well it took me many calls but I got $70 taken off my Home Depot bill so far. One more call to make about them removing the tank, I'm pretty sure home depot said that was free. The contractor company guy I talked today at least gave me a better explanation but I let him know I wasn't happy since that was the 3rd explanation I had received from them and the only one that even came close to making any sense.
He said it is a flat fee they charge (they have 3 depending on the age of the water heater, mine turned out to be the middle flat fee) and that it includes anything that isn't done on the basic install, i.e. copper fittings, the T & P relief valve which controls the pressure and the keeps the water temperature from rising to high; AND he says it includes the draining/removal/and getting rid of the old water heater. Well, now I have to question Home Depot about this as I'm pretty sure they told me they would get rid of the old one for free yet the contractor is including this in that set $258. Still kind of feeling screwed but $70 less than I was before. He said that relief valve does control the pressure but they have to be on all water heaters no matter that I might have a PSI regulator somewhere else before the water comes into the house. We'll see as I'm going to check Home Depot's web site then call their installation number and talk to one of the guys who sets up the whole installation process. I thought sure they told me there was no charge for taking my old one away, just like other appliances.
To be continued..................
He said it is a flat fee they charge (they have 3 depending on the age of the water heater, mine turned out to be the middle flat fee) and that it includes anything that isn't done on the basic install, i.e. copper fittings, the T & P relief valve which controls the pressure and the keeps the water temperature from rising to high; AND he says it includes the draining/removal/and getting rid of the old water heater. Well, now I have to question Home Depot about this as I'm pretty sure they told me they would get rid of the old one for free yet the contractor is including this in that set $258. Still kind of feeling screwed but $70 less than I was before. He said that relief valve does control the pressure but they have to be on all water heaters no matter that I might have a PSI regulator somewhere else before the water comes into the house. We'll see as I'm going to check Home Depot's web site then call their installation number and talk to one of the guys who sets up the whole installation process. I thought sure they told me there was no charge for taking my old one away, just like other appliances.
To be continued..................
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I called Aaron back and asked him what the $70 refund was for and he told me that there were two charges, $50 Redo Water lines (labor) and $20 parts that should have not been on my bill as they were all part of the $197 basic install charge. Then I told him I went to Home Depot's web site and found the statement that the removal and disposal of the water heater was free, no extra charge. Well Aaron then quickly told me he would talk to his manager and he would get back with me about this issue.
Alex the Bulgarian (aarrrgggghhhh dang accents) called me back immediately. Well he told me the last guy I talked to, Aaron, was wrong when he said that $258 charge included the costs of the removal and disposal of the old hot water heater and since he is the manager his explanation is the one that counts. Alex said that the water heater and disposal is free. Well I talked and talked and it was like being on a dang merry go round, it always came back to "my word is the one that counts and I will talk to my staff". I told him I had 4 different responses to my questions about what the $298 fee was and it was getting exasperating. He again said "mine is the explanation that counts." Then he told me that he "pretty much" (Delta Mechanical, Inc.) is an employee of Home Depot and does all their local contract plumbing work. Sooooo I'm thinking, should I call Home Depot and complain about their "employees" and how no one knows what the other one is saying or doing? AND if they had this extra $70 fee on my bill, how many other poor bozos had it on their bill and didn't argue it let alone figure it all out? Geez what a pain this has been and I'm still not totally satisfied.
Any Suggestions......take the $70 and run or call Home Depot and complain about their employee Delta Mechanical?
I called Aaron back and asked him what the $70 refund was for and he told me that there were two charges, $50 Redo Water lines (labor) and $20 parts that should have not been on my bill as they were all part of the $197 basic install charge. Then I told him I went to Home Depot's web site and found the statement that the removal and disposal of the water heater was free, no extra charge. Well Aaron then quickly told me he would talk to his manager and he would get back with me about this issue.
Alex the Bulgarian (aarrrgggghhhh dang accents) called me back immediately. Well he told me the last guy I talked to, Aaron, was wrong when he said that $258 charge included the costs of the removal and disposal of the old hot water heater and since he is the manager his explanation is the one that counts. Alex said that the water heater and disposal is free. Well I talked and talked and it was like being on a dang merry go round, it always came back to "my word is the one that counts and I will talk to my staff". I told him I had 4 different responses to my questions about what the $298 fee was and it was getting exasperating. He again said "mine is the explanation that counts." Then he told me that he "pretty much" (Delta Mechanical, Inc.) is an employee of Home Depot and does all their local contract plumbing work. Sooooo I'm thinking, should I call Home Depot and complain about their "employees" and how no one knows what the other one is saying or doing? AND if they had this extra $70 fee on my bill, how many other poor bozos had it on their bill and didn't argue it let alone figure it all out? Geez what a pain this has been and I'm still not totally satisfied.
Any Suggestions......take the $70 and run or call Home Depot and complain about their employee Delta Mechanical?
Since I have all the details posted here, I'm going to cut and paste all the info I posted into a document so if I do call Home Depot I have it all documented from here and won't leave out any of this unbelievable tale and adventure. Wow this has been like a documentary. I should have just bought a vacumn cleaner and done without a water heater.
Did Home Depot quote you a installed price? Most Home Depot stores I have seen quote installed prices. If this was the case and the actual price was going to be higher then they quoted you and you didn't sign for it, tell them to remove it. Then call a reputable plumbing contractor. I'm betting it would cost you a lot less without the hassle.
John
John
I myself would attempt to deal with your dilemma at the local level Home Depot. If you have no success, I would make sure you were not going to be pushed aside and collect every first and last name of all persons contacted, and submit a letter to the corporate office of Home Depot.
Lastly, if this fails, it is time to submit some "Letters to the Editor" at your local newspaper, contact the BBB, and file a small claims court action.
Lastly, if this fails, it is time to submit some "Letters to the Editor" at your local newspaper, contact the BBB, and file a small claims court action.
Well a plumber friend who lives out of state now said "The T&P valve is a safety valve on ALL water heater- MOST of the water heaters now a days come with the T&P valve already installed at the factory!"
So out of curiosity I went and looked up the description of my water heater online and found this:
The GE 40 Gallon 9 Year Medium Electric water heater provides a ample supply of hot water for a 1 - 2 bath home. This unit comes with two 4500 watt elements, a factory installed temperature and pressure relief valve and requires a 240 volt electrical connection for installation. The automatic thermostat keeps the water at desired temperature. The 9 year model features a stainless steel upper element which resists dry firing and scale build-up. This model also comes with a self cleaning system that helps reduce sediment and increases tank life and is easy to maintain. This model has a 9 year tank and parts limited warranty.
Now it wasn't the manager Alex that told me the installation and purchase relief valve was part of the $258 fee but Aaron did. There's not one person in that office that has the same tale to tell, it's getting maddening!!! I have to go into town tomorrow so I think I'll swing by my local Home Depot store and see who I can talk to. And yes they gave me an installed price when I set up the installation. At the time I didn't have a clue if that was high or low. My husband used to do all this but since he died last year I'm learning a lot about this kind of stuff. But what made me wonder was when I got the itemized PDF file in my e-mail after the installation, that's when I started questioning especially the $258 fee. Then I find out the $50 and the $20 fees shouldn't have been there either which of course they are refunding.
Yes, if I don't get any satisfaction locally I've thought about putting a small note in our Letter to the Editor's column in our small local paper.
So out of curiosity I went and looked up the description of my water heater online and found this:
The GE 40 Gallon 9 Year Medium Electric water heater provides a ample supply of hot water for a 1 - 2 bath home. This unit comes with two 4500 watt elements, a factory installed temperature and pressure relief valve and requires a 240 volt electrical connection for installation. The automatic thermostat keeps the water at desired temperature. The 9 year model features a stainless steel upper element which resists dry firing and scale build-up. This model also comes with a self cleaning system that helps reduce sediment and increases tank life and is easy to maintain. This model has a 9 year tank and parts limited warranty.
Now it wasn't the manager Alex that told me the installation and purchase relief valve was part of the $258 fee but Aaron did. There's not one person in that office that has the same tale to tell, it's getting maddening!!! I have to go into town tomorrow so I think I'll swing by my local Home Depot store and see who I can talk to. And yes they gave me an installed price when I set up the installation. At the time I didn't have a clue if that was high or low. My husband used to do all this but since he died last year I'm learning a lot about this kind of stuff. But what made me wonder was when I got the itemized PDF file in my e-mail after the installation, that's when I started questioning especially the $258 fee. Then I find out the $50 and the $20 fees shouldn't have been there either which of course they are refunding.
Yes, if I don't get any satisfaction locally I've thought about putting a small note in our Letter to the Editor's column in our small local paper.
Don't give up. You got ripped and you should be reimbursed for the over charge and BS they are feeding you.
In my opinion, retail stores shouldn't be allowed to get involved in installation of their products.
The T&P valve that they told you regulated the temp and pressure is also BS. It is a safety valve that will open and release water if it gets too hot or too high in pressure. The thermostat regulates the temperature and if your on city water with pressure over 70psi or so, you would have a pressure regulating valve in your plumbing before the heater.
In my opinion, retail stores shouldn't be allowed to get involved in installation of their products.
The T&P valve that they told you regulated the temp and pressure is also BS. It is a safety valve that will open and release water if it gets too hot or too high in pressure. The thermostat regulates the temperature and if your on city water with pressure over 70psi or so, you would have a pressure regulating valve in your plumbing before the heater.
Speedbump, YUP I do have a PSI regulator on my well water tank before the water comes into the house. Of Course the manager told me that that made no difference since this T & P valve is mandated. Well that's fine, except it comes already installed on the tank I bought. I'm going to town today and talk to someone at my local Home Depot store. So far Home Depot has been pretty good at following up on this BUT Shawn the guy from the Atlanta Office doesn't really understand water heaters and charges and he pretty much admitted it, especially when he couldn't understand the more detailed info I was giving him. So we'll see what happens today. I did print off my notes here so I know the dates and sequence of events of everyone I've talked to up to date and the information I was given by each one.
I can't tell you how important keeping detailed notes are. It won a lawsuit for us from a guy who refused to pay us for a well repair. And lots of other things, without them it's just your word against theirs, but with the notes, it's real hard to argue against them. Judges love it.
Well, I took my notes and went to Home Depot. I ended up talking to two managers. One was a lady and they both listened to my story. Then she picked up the phone and called someone she knew (Alexander whom I talked to last) at the contractor's office. But Alex wasn't in so she talked to a named was George. She talked to him about 5 minutes and she told me that he told her pretty much what the last guy I talked to had said about it was a flat fee (mine in the middle range) for bringing the hot water heater up to code. Both managers said that the sad part is that only I and the contractor can actually pull up the charges on the bill. She said if she pulled up my account right now it would only show the fee of $875 for a hot water heater installation. She had also verified with George that they were giving me a $70 refund also. Since they're just a local store they both told me there isn't much that they can do. I asked them if there was someone else besides the 800 number people to talk to at Home Depot. They both started thinking about that and then the lady went and got her rolodex and gave me a name and number for a guy who is higher up and actually deals with the contractors for Home Depot. They both agreed that this guy would probably be the guy to talk to. So come Monday I call him. By the time I left, after about 30 minutes talking to both managers, they both agreed that there was something not right about the whole situation. What really got their attention was the fact that all of a sudden, after many calls to the contractors, they "suddenly" discovered the two over charges to my bill. To them that seemed to be the kicker, "why all of a sudden did they discover this over charge". I figure that since I wasn't giving this issue up easily, the contractor knew it would only be a matter of time before someone higher up in Home Depot would discover the over charge. I'm sure they thought I'd just go away after the refund.
Both managers told me that my pursuing it was the right thing to do and that it might at least ensure this contract company may not get the Home Depot contract again and possibly keep other people from being over charged. She said she thought they only had a contract for a year or two and then had to reapply. I doubt I'll get any more of the fees reduced but maybe I'll get a little satisfaction
So the saga will continue Monday.
Both managers told me that my pursuing it was the right thing to do and that it might at least ensure this contract company may not get the Home Depot contract again and possibly keep other people from being over charged. She said she thought they only had a contract for a year or two and then had to reapply. I doubt I'll get any more of the fees reduced but maybe I'll get a little satisfaction
So the saga will continue Monday.
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Was the $875.00 the original price Home Depot gave you for the heater and installation? If so and you didn't give approval for any additional costs then all you have to pay is the 875.
The plumber has a contract with Home Depot to install for a flat fee. That they pay him. Any additional costs would be between you and the plumber. But you would have to agree to them before installation.
John
The plumber has a contract with Home Depot to install for a flat fee. That they pay him. Any additional costs would be between you and the plumber. But you would have to agree to them before installation.
John
John
The $875 was the quote they gave me when I discussed the finer points of what I needed, what my water heater was now, etc. I did agree to that total when I talked on the phone with the person who set up the installation appt. I thought it seemed kind of high but I never had to deal with this before and it's been a long time since we had a water heater replaced, so I figured prices had just skyrocketed like everything else in the last few years. I didn't question anything until I received the itemized PDF file in my e-mail. The installer just left me a receipt that only showed the $875 fee for the installation.
At first I just wanted to know exactly what the $258 fee was for. I wasn't upset at this point I just thought I should call for clarification of what the fee involved. Then it all went down hill when after 5 conversations gave me 4 different answers. And of course I'm sure most people would have been thrilled when all of a sudden they saw I had been charged $70 too much and they were going to refund me. So that means that now the water heater is costing me about $805 instead of $875. But I'm a little concerned about the $50 labor and the $20 parts they are refunding me because the last two guys I talked to at the plumbing company said they were charges that should not have been on the bill. My concern now, how many other previous customers had these charges on their bills but never questioned them. I'm not going to get anymore refunds out of this issue but now it's a matter of principle. I've been dealing with this issue via phone tag for almost a month now. And this plumbing group has been dancing around the issues and explanations the entire time.
The $875 was the quote they gave me when I discussed the finer points of what I needed, what my water heater was now, etc. I did agree to that total when I talked on the phone with the person who set up the installation appt. I thought it seemed kind of high but I never had to deal with this before and it's been a long time since we had a water heater replaced, so I figured prices had just skyrocketed like everything else in the last few years. I didn't question anything until I received the itemized PDF file in my e-mail. The installer just left me a receipt that only showed the $875 fee for the installation.
At first I just wanted to know exactly what the $258 fee was for. I wasn't upset at this point I just thought I should call for clarification of what the fee involved. Then it all went down hill when after 5 conversations gave me 4 different answers. And of course I'm sure most people would have been thrilled when all of a sudden they saw I had been charged $70 too much and they were going to refund me. So that means that now the water heater is costing me about $805 instead of $875. But I'm a little concerned about the $50 labor and the $20 parts they are refunding me because the last two guys I talked to at the plumbing company said they were charges that should not have been on the bill. My concern now, how many other previous customers had these charges on their bills but never questioned them. I'm not going to get anymore refunds out of this issue but now it's a matter of principle. I've been dealing with this issue via phone tag for almost a month now. And this plumbing group has been dancing around the issues and explanations the entire time.
In that case I would take my $70.00 and drop it. You had a contract with them for $875.00. They didn't have to refund you anything. The time to question the price was before you gave them the OK to install it. I'm not saying that they didn't over charge you, but I think you should also be honoring your word that you would pay the price that you excepted.
John
John
I never heard any thing good about HD sub-contractors.
I noticed in the picture that they sued p-tape to secure the heater to the wall and floor. Are you in California or some locality that requires earthquake / siesmic straps on water heaters?
If so that will not meet those requirements.
The reason I ask is why would a a cheesy contractor even take the time to do that unless he thought maybe he was fulfilling that requirement.
Just adding more fuel to the fire.
I noticed in the picture that they sued p-tape to secure the heater to the wall and floor. Are you in California or some locality that requires earthquake / siesmic straps on water heaters?
If so that will not meet those requirements.
The reason I ask is why would a a cheesy contractor even take the time to do that unless he thought maybe he was fulfilling that requirement.
Just adding more fuel to the fire.
John, I somewhat agree that yes I agreed to the $875 charge but the issue I have is that I was not shown an itemized breakdown of the exact charges until after the installer left when it then showed up in my e-mail. The installer wouldn't have the breakdown, he just does the job they tell him and leaves (and doesn't speak good English). Having never had to go through having a water heater put in, I didn't know if this was a "high" or "normal" complete install charge. But once I saw the breakdown, I first just questioned the $258 fee that was worded so I had no clue to what the charges were for since I already saw the additional charges for the "basic installation, parts and labor." This started out just to get an explanation of what that $258 fee was for. I would think most people might question that. It was after getting 4 different explanations from the contractor that I really started getting irritated. If you have a charge on a bill I would hope that most companies have a set definition of what that fee includes. So I will still probably talk to the guy at Home Depot. He'll know if this is standard operating procedures for a plumbing company. If it is, no harm no foul, if it's not, then maybe Home Depot needs to tell this contractor "that works for them" to get together with all of their employees and explain to them the definition so that they are all on the same page and not all out in left, right and center field. I don't expect any more refunds, but there are people out there that don't know anything about plumbing, me for one, that would have no clue. Like I said no harm no foul if this is all on the up and up.
Mr. David. Those straps were on the old water heater also so the installer just reattached it the way the old water heater was attached which is fine with me. I live in a large manufactured home so I suspect that they're there because they have to move the homes and it stabilizes them during the move. I live AZ, very few earthquakes here.
Mr. David. Those straps were on the old water heater also so the installer just reattached it the way the old water heater was attached which is fine with me. I live in a large manufactured home so I suspect that they're there because they have to move the homes and it stabilizes them during the move. I live AZ, very few earthquakes here.
