Plumber installed a new 'frost free' hydrant. I was told it's normal for it to leak?

[Leoman]

3 months ago my main water cutoff valve was replaced and the hose bib replaced by a frost free hydrant.

The main cutoff valve is in the ground surrounded by a PVC pipe, and the hydrant is right next to it. The PVC pipe has been half full of water ever since they worked in it, and I was told today that the water is from the frost free hydrant and is normal.

Is it normal though? I was thinking there's still a leak where they connected the new valve underground and they're blaming the excess water on the hydrant.

These pics were taken just after it was done, but the water level in the main cutoff valve pipe has been 16" from the top of the pipe for 3 months. I can't even see the valve and seems like it could freeze over in the winter so I can't access it.



This is the frost free hydrant right next to the PVC pipe leading to the main cutoff valve, again taken right after they installed it.





I was just told the water in the PVC pipe is from the hydrant and normal. I've only used the hydrant twice in 3 months, so it must be leaking constantly.

 

[MicEd69]

It is not normal for a hydrant to "leak". However, the valve seat of the hydrant is at the bottom of the hydrant. When it is turned off, the water in the pipe drains to a bed of rock at the connection point to the supply line, AKA French drain. But if you don't use the hydrant very often and there is still water in that adjacent pipe, you either have a high water table, or the hydrant or the shutoff valve is indeed leaking.

 

[Twowaxhack]

You either have a leak or you don’t.

 

[Leoman]

It is not normal for a hydrant to "leak". However, the valve seat of the hydrant is at the bottom of the hydrant. When it is turned off, the water in the pipe drains to a bed of rock at the connection point to the supply line, AKA French drain. But if you don't use the hydrant very often and there is still water in that adjacent pipe, you either have a high water table, or the hydrant or the shutoff valve is indeed leaking.

That's what I was thinking. The manager (plumber's wife) said if the high water level in the PVC pipe is bothering me they can move the hydrant a few feet away since the frost free feature is causing the excess water.

The town shutoff is closer to the street and a similar setup, a pipe in the ground with a valve at the bottom, and it's completely dry so it's not the water table. It looks even deeper than the valve by the house with no moisture at all.

They did some other work for me yesterday and were supposed to fix this, but I think he didn't feel like digging and made up an excuse why there's so much water.

 

[Twowaxhack]

If the hydrant drains itself every-time you use it then it would accumulate water at the base and how much it accumulates would depend on several factors.

If you have a city meter you can watch the indicator on the meter to see if you have a leak. Or you could stop using the hydrant for a few days and it should dry out.

 

[Leoman]

If the hydrant drains itself every-time you use it then it would accumulate water at the base and how much it accumulates would depend on several factors.

If you have a city meter you can watch the indicator on the meter to see if you have a leak. Or you could stop using the hydrant for a few days and it should dry out.

I don't have a meter or pay by water usage. It's just a flat rate every 3 months.

I haven't used the hydrant in over a week. I've only used it 2 or 3 times briefly in 3 months and the water level never goes down. If I suck the water out with a shop vac it's filled back up to the same level the next day.

 

[MicEd69]

I don't have a meter or pay by water usage. It's just a flat rate every 3 months.

I haven't used the hydrant in over a week. I've only used it 2 or 3 times briefly in 3 months and the water level never goes down. If I suck the water out with a shop vac it's filled back up to the same level the next day.

Well, the good news is that paying a flat rate means this issue is not costing you anything. The bad news is that you have a leak. The water has to come from somewhere!

 

[Leoman]

Well, the good news is that paying a flat rate means this issue is not costing you anything. The bad news is that you have a leak. The water has to come from somewhere!

According to them it's coming from the hydrant and supposed to be like that. lol

I guess I'll have to convince them to try to fix it. Otherwise I'll have to hire someone else and send them the bill.

 

[MicEd69]

The only way it can be coming from the hydrant in a normal situation is if you are using that hydrant lots and turning it on and off lots. I suppose if you have the hose connected to something that has lots of water in it and the hydrant is off, the water could drain back into the hydrant and into the French drain, but that shouldn't be a solid connection anyway.

 

[Twowaxhack]

I don't have a meter or pay by water usage. It's just a flat rate every 3 months.

I haven't used the hydrant in over a week. I've only used it 2 or 3 times briefly in 3 months and the water level never goes down. If I suck the water out with a shop vac it's filled back up to the same level the next day.

You could install a pressure gauge on the system some place and turn the water off at the source and watch the gauge for about 30 minutes and see if it drops. If it drops you have a leak.

Turn your water heater to pilot and turn off any automatic valves like ice makers etc.

Or you could dig it up.

 

[Twowaxhack]

 

[MicEd69]

Yep, that could be an issue. It wouldn't have to be a solid connection like I said. And with the hose coiled up like it is, the water in the hose could be siphoning back into the hydrant and draining through the drain hole. But the hose nozzle would have to be open, and the hose would have to be used quite often to maintain the water level in the ground at a rather constant level.

 

[pasadena_commut]

But the hose nozzle would have to be open

Well, yes, but a lot of hose nozzles never fully shut off, and that is open enough. That would let air into that end of the hose, breaking the vacuum, and allowing the water to siphon out. Slowly anyway.

, and the hose would have to be used quite often to maintain the water level in the ground at a rather constant level.

Agree on that. Easy enough to remove this possibility, just unhook the hose from the hydrant for now.

If I was the OP, and it was leaking days after the hose was detached, I would dig down to the base of the hydrant and find out once and for all if it is leaking. If it is call the people who installed it, tell them that you can see it leaking continuously, and that they need to fix it.