Cold Pipes

[nicnicman]

While making some changes on a floor plan I noticed that some of the plumbing is on the outside wall. In the picture you are looking at the first floor. The house is on slab and will be build in a cold area.

Some areas of concern:

the Washer/Dryer on the garage wall (the garage will not be insulated)
the Furnace and Water heater on the outside wall
the toilet

Since the Washer/Dryer is on the garage wall and not actually an exterior wall maybe it will be fine. And I suppose the plumbing for the Furnace and Water heater could be run in the slab or in the adjacent wall. Lastly, could the plumbing for the toilet be run directly into the slab?

Maybe they're not problem areas after all. What do you think? Should I be concerned about pipes freezing in these areas? Thanks for any suggestions

 

[IFIXH20]

Not sure how cold it get where you are, but if the home has stucco, brick, or siding-- then sheeting,plywood,insulation I think you will be ok. I would run water heater lines in wall (wall should be insulated) between laundry & garage. The furnace should be ok you only have a gas line, unless you have geothermal heating. I personally do not like shower valves or tub valves on outside walls in case of valve replacement.

 

[nicnicman]

The house will be built in Maine with vinyl siding (most likely), typar, osb, and fiberglass insulation. As an added precaution we could use spray foam (Corbond) in plumbing areas.

Thanks for the help. I don't think the plumber doing the job will have an issue with the layout either. Tomorrow, I'll visit him and make sure though.

 

[johnjh2o]

As far as the toilet supply goes it can be run under the slab. It will be well within the frost wall for the foundation. Which in your area should be 48" below the ground. The only other problem would be if you didn't close the garage door. That would put the laundry lines in danger of freezing. Not just the water lines but also the trap if it's inside the wall.

John

 

[IFIXH20]

The only other problem would be if you didn't close the garage door. That would put the laundry lines in danger of freezing. Not just the water lines but also the trap if it's inside the wall.

John[/QUOTE]

I ran into this a number of years ago, home owner left for the weekend and left garage door open -- Second floor master bath over Garage shower drain trap froze.

 

[Fred12]

I think it's a definite concern. My home now has this problem, and every winter we have to keep space heaters in a couple of the bathrooms. Otherwise the pipes freeze and the toilets won't flush.

 

[nicnicman]

Thanks for the suggestions everybody. Could the laundry plumbing lines be run inside the room directly into the slab avoiding the wall all together?

 

[johnjh2o]

I was going to suggest just that. If there is no objection to the appearance I would also do it with the washer trap. That for sure would protect them from freezing.

John

 

[nicnicman]

Wouldn't the lines be behind the washer anyway? How much of them would you see?

 

[johnjh2o]

They don't have to be behind the machine. With the waste line behind the machine it would hold the machine that much further away from the wall. What is done often in a finished laundry room both the waste and water lines are run into a laundry box. Which is installed inside the wall.

http://www.homedepot.com/buy/oatey/no-38934-2-in-washing-machine-outlet-box-64722.html#.UCMPu_ZlRqM
John

 

[nicnicman]

Thanks for the info, John. What if I put the laundry box in the wall between the utility closet and the laundry room? The utility closet isn't heated, but it would provide a little more protection to the plumbing.

 

[johnjh2o]

Great drawing but I'm not sure were the closet is. If it's a inside wall it would be a good location.

John

 

[nicnicman]

The closet is inside the garage. There is shared wall between the garage and the laundry with the closet in the corner of the garage.

Not sure if this clear or not. Thanks again.

 

[IFIXH20]

Nicnicman, you mention in a earlier post that your garage walls will not be insulated, being you are that far north, I would insulate all my garage walls, it will help out on your utilty bill.

 

[johnjh2o]

The closet is inside the garage. There is shared wall between the garage and the laundry with the closet in the corner of the garage.

Not sure if this clear or not. Thanks again.

I think you would be looking for trouble putting the lines in that wall. Is the reason your not insulating that wall is because it's block? Even if that wall was insulated I wouldn't advise putting the lines in that wall.

John

 

[nicnicman]

The shared wall between the house and garage will be insulated and sheetrocked on both sides (as per fire code). The utility closet will also be insulated all the way around. All other garage walls will not be insulated.

 

[johnjh2o]

The problem is insulation doesn't create heat. If you use a laundry box they are almost 4" deep. Which doesn't leave much room to get insulation behind it. What your trying to accomplish is to have the insulation between the pipe and the cold area and keeping the lines exposed to the warm area. So packing insulation around the pipe will be insulating the line from the heat. Like I said before exposing the lines in the laundry room would be the safest thing to do.

John