Best Replacement Options for 120 gallon Pressure Tank

[jschroeder]

I currently have a 120 gallon Wellmate pressure tank WM35-WB that I believe is pushing 20 years in age (I purchased home a few years ago & think its original to the build) & I'm considering a replacement. In shopping around, Menards sells a 119 gallon tank from a company called "State" MPT-119, which appears to be very comparable to the Wellmate aside from the State being steel vs the fiberglass Wellmate. The State tank is much more affordable, so I was curious as to whether there were any notable differences in quality between the two tanks. Any feedback would be appreciated.

 

[Valveman]

My favorite would be the Water Worker brand, as it is the same as a WX350 made by Amtrol. But that is not a cheap tank. 30+ years ago I would have recommended as large a tank as you could get. But these days you can have much stronger constant pressure in the house and use a much smaller and less expensive tank by controlling the pump with a Cycle Stop Valve. Big tanks slow down the cycling. But you can't put on a large enough tank to stop the cycling the way a Cycle Stop Valve does.

 

[jschroeder]

Thank you for the feedback. Upon watching the video and then going to the cyclestop website here is what I found in terms of a potential replacement for my current set up.

https://cyclestopvalves.com/pages/pk1a-pside-kick
Between this and the water works 120 gallon tank referenced above, which would you recommend? Cost is always a factor, but I plan on being in this home for a long time and given we have a sizeable garden and little kids, I'd trade a few extra $$ for consistent and strong pressure.

 

[Valveman]

The PK1A fits most applications. But do you know anything about the pump like horsepower, gpm, or depth?

 

[jschroeder]

I honestly don't...I dont recall coming across a manual or related paperwork for it from the old owners. I'll double check tonight though. Assuming I cant track that down, any recommendations for determining that info?

 

[Valveman]

Having a 119 gallon size tank that holds about 30 gallons of water makes me think you may have a 30 GPM pump. However, you could just have a 10 GPM pump and someone added such a huge tank to reduce the cycling on and off. If there is a control box on the wires before they go down the well it will have a tag that gives you the horsepower. If there is no control box other than a pressure switch, that limits it to a 1.5HP or smaller. While the pump is running, clipping an AC amp meter around one of the hot wires at the breaker, control box, or maybe the pressure switch will also give you the horsepower. 1HP is 9 amps, 1.5HP is 12 amps, and so on. A bucket test with a wide open valve or multiple taps open will help with the GPM series. 17 GPM wide open is a 10 GPM series pump and so on. With a bucket test and an amp reading I can pretty much tell you what pump you have. I can even get pretty close to the pumping water level in the well if you note the pressure on the gauge when doing the bucket test..

Really all we are looking for is how much pressure your pump can build, as that is how much pressure will be on the lines prior to the CSV. After the CSV the lines will see the normal 40 to 60 max and a constant 50 PSI when water is being used.

 

[Twowaxhack]

I currently have a 120 gallon Wellmate pressure tank WM35-WB that I believe is pushing 20 years in age (I purchased home a few years ago & think its original to the build) & I'm considering a replacement. In shopping around, Menards sells a 119 gallon tank from a company called "State" MPT-119, which appears to be very comparable to the Wellmate aside from the State being steel vs the fiberglass Wellmate. The State tank is much more affordable, so I was curious as to whether there were any notable differences in quality between the two tanks. Any feedback would be appreciated.

If you want good pressure, kick it up to 70 psi. That’s a good number.

 

[hdserv]

Thanks for the education, all.
I'm new to the forum and to well pumps. I'm hvac by trade, and I'm not a plumber.

I recently replaced/relocated 86 gallon water worker tank, replaced pressure control (30-50 psi) and pressure gauge (didn't change these location, though).

The (original) pump is 1.5 hp, draws 11.6 amps, I did a bucket test with a garden hose., I got a little more than 5 gallons in one minute at 40 psi

I'm am having issues with the pressure control Rapid on/off at the beginning and end as the pumps cycles.
I'm hopeful I didn't create a problem (tank relocation)? And,
Can you tell me if installing a

CSV1A CYCLE STOP VALVE will solve/improve my issue?​

Daniel

 

[RS]

Thanks for the education, all.
I'm new to the forum and to well pumps. I'm hvac by trade, and I'm not a plumber.

I recently replaced/relocated 86 gallon water worker tank, replaced pressure control (30-50 psi) and pressure gauge (didn't change these location, though).

The (original) pump is 1.5 hp, draws 11.6 amps, I did a bucket test with a garden hose., I got a little more than 5 gallons in one minute at 40 psi

I'm am having issues with the pressure control Rapid on/off at the beginning and end as the pumps cycles.
I'm hopeful I didn't create a problem (tank relocation)? And,
Can you tell me if installing a

CSV1A CYCLE STOP VALVE will solve/improve my issue?​

Daniel

The pressure control switch and pressure tank have to be very close together, otherwise you will experience the problem your having. One solution is to add another smaller pressure tank right near the switch.

 

[hdserv]

One solution is to add another smaller pressure tank right near the switch.

Thanks, I'll definitely give that a try.

D

 

[hdserv]

Success!

Thanks again, RS. My pressure switch issue is resolved.

Daniel

 

[RS]

Success!

Thanks again, RS. My pressure switch issue is resolved.

Daniel

Glad I could help, thanks for the update! I helped a friend with the same problem 20 years ago!

 

[Valveman]

Thanks for the education, all.
I'm new to the forum and to well pumps. I'm hvac by trade, and I'm not a plumber.

I recently replaced/relocated 86 gallon water worker tank, replaced pressure control (30-50 psi) and pressure gauge (didn't change these location, though).

The (original) pump is 1.5 hp, draws 11.6 amps, I did a bucket test with a garden hose., I got a little more than 5 gallons in one minute at 40 psi

I'm am having issues with the pressure control Rapid on/off at the beginning and end as the pumps cycles.
I'm hopeful I didn't create a problem (tank relocation)? And,
Can you tell me if installing a

CSV1A CYCLE STOP VALVE will solve/improve my issue?​

Daniel

The pressure switch does need to be fairly close to a pressure tank to stop the telegraphing on/off bounce. A CSV would not help with that. But when using a CSV you no longer even need the large tank. You could install a CSV1A before the pressure switch and small tank, and you would have strong constant 40 PSI all the time water is being used, instead of 30 to 50 over and over again like you have now. 40 PSI constant would seem so much stronger than when bouncing between 30 and 50 that people tell me they no longer even need soap in the shower. Lol!

Strong constant pressure is just a beneficial side effect of the CSV. The main purpose of the CSV is to eliminate pump cycling, which will make the pump, tank, and everything in the pump system last several times longer than normal. Which size tank you use with the CSV is a moot point, as the CSV will still protect the pump from destructive on/off cycling no matter the size of the tank.

 

[hdserv]

Thanks for that Valveman!

I'm wondering if it's advisable and if my older pump can handle 40-60 psi. I'd want to upgrade to,

https://cyclestopvalves.com/collections/all/products/custom-pk1a-pside-kick-kit

 

[Valveman]

I don't think you got a good test on your 1.5HP pump. 5 GPM is probably all the faucet would let out, not how much the pump can produce. To do a proper bucket test you need to open enough faucets or one big valve to keep the pressure as low as possible. With the pump running, make a not of the pressure on the gauge like 20 PSI, and measure the water at all the open faucets and add together.

I am sure that is not a 5 GPM, 1.5HP. It is probably more like a 15-25 GPM pump. A wide open bucket test would tell you which size pump it is. But either way, it should make probably a 100 PSI or so, and you can turn up the pressure switch as needed.

 

[hdserv]

Thanks, Valveman!
There's a hose bib located directly beyond the pump and check-valve.
I'll do another test.

Daniel

 

[hdserv]

I just now did another bucket test.
I got approx. 15 gallons in one minute, pressure was 35-40psi while the pump was running.

 

[Valveman]

I just now did another bucket test.
I got approx. 15 gallons in one minute, pressure was 35-40psi while the pump was running.

OK, good numbers. If they are correct you have a 11.6 amp, 10 GPM, 1.5HP, pumping from a 180'-200' deep water level. Also means you would have about 160 PSI back pressure on any pipe prior to a CSV. The CSV1A would be good to about 200 PSI, so it would work fine.

Again, just want to make sure there is no bleeder orifice about 5' down the well?

 

[hdserv]

Thanks, Valveman!

Is it possible to visually check to see if there's a bleeder orifice? By removing the top cover of the well head and shining a light down the well while the pump is running?

 

[Valveman]

If you can see down the well head just look for a tee sticking out to the side about 5'-10' down. If you can't see down there, take the plug out of the top of the galv tee on top of the well. If the water is not up to the plug and drained down there is either a bleeder down there or a hole in the pipe.