Is there an electric appliance to pre-heat water before entering my 40 gallon gas water heater?

[boblite]

Here in New Jersey in summer months the hot water from our 40 gallon water heater lasts about 40 minutes. It's now 15 degrees Fahrenheit and hot water lasts about 10 minutes because extremely cold water is coming into my 40 gallon gas water heater. If the water coming into the tank could be pre-heated to around 80F we could have hot water lasting like in summer. Is there any electrical heating device on the market that does this?

 

[Twowaxhack]

Rheem makes one for the outlet.

https://www.rheem.com/innovations/innovation_residential/water-heater-booster/
You could also turn the temp up and install a tempering valve.

 

[kiwi_outdoors]

Rheem makes one for the outlet.

https://www.rheem.com/innovations/innovation_residential/water-heater-booster/
You could also turn the temp up and install a tempering valve.

yup - the gadget, if sized for a 40 gallon tank, needs 30 A at 240V. Not trivial.

 

[Twowaxhack]

yup - the gadget, if sized for a 40 gallon tank, needs 30 A at 240V. Not trivial.

So what, it does basically what he’s asking to do and it doesn’t take up much room.

 

[kiwi_outdoors]

So what, it does basically what he’s asking to do and it doesn’t take up much room.

Well, it depends. the Insta hots that I was looking at for our kitchen needed more power than outlet would deliver, which is why I simply added a 2.5 gallon electric Rheem, in series with, and after, the gas tankless, to service the kitchen sink. Its working great.

 

[Twowaxhack]

Well, it depends. the Insta hots that I was looking at for our kitchen needed more power than outlet would deliver, which is why I simply added a 2.5 gallon electric Rheem, in series with, and after, the gas tankless, to service the kitchen sink. Its working great.

What’s that got to do with the product I linked ? Your kitchen has nothing to do with this mans house and no one mentioned anything about only using an outlet.

It’s apples and oranges. I’m not sure why you posted about your thread on this thread........

You adding that small of a tank in series only gave you hot water quickly. It wouldn’t help in any significant way with a whole house running out of hot water situation.

 

[BlueSkyHigh]

How old is your water heater? Gas or electric? If electric, one of the heating elements (if it's equipped with two) may have gone "tango uniform". If gas, is it possible that the burner isn't putting out all the BTUs it was designed to produce?

We have had similar temperatures here in Northern Virginia for about the past week and my daughter still is able to "shower for an hour" without complaint except from her parents who pay the energy bills, for attempting to sing an entire operetta in the shower while the gas meter spins even with the dishwasher in mid-cycle. For me, I've got showering down to about three minutes all inclusive but I know that's not an option for many. We also wash clothes with cold water only.

Our two year old A.O. Smith gas fired 50 gallon unit seems to be able to keep up with the demand.

(PS. The Rube Goldberg Tim The Toolman Taylor part of me says that if you've got the space put two 40 gallon tanks in series and let her rip.)

Good luck!

 

[Mitchell-DIY-Guy]

@BlueSkyHigh is asking the right questions. @boblite its quite possible that your water heater is beyond its service life, there could be multiple problems with it. If it's relatively new (less than 5 years) you may have an issue with it worth repairing. If much older than than, you probably want to replace it.

The Rheem hot water booster that @Twowaxhack spoke about sounds interesting if used in the right context, an augmentation to an existing, working HW system. But, if your primary tank has a problem such as a bad heating element, fix that first.

Look at "first hour" ratings...they can tell you what your water heater is supposed to make.

 

[Twowaxhack]

@BlueSkyHigh is asking the right questions. @boblite its quite possible that your water heater is beyond its service life, there could be multiple problems with it. If it's relatively new (less than 5 years) you may have an issue with it worth repairing. If much older than than, you probably want to replace it.

The Rheem hot water booster that @Twowaxhack spoke about sounds interesting if used in the right context, an augmentation to an existing, working HW system. But, if your primary tank has a problem such as a bad heating element, fix that first.

Look at "first hour" ratings...they can tell you what your water heater is supposed to make.

I can assure you his problem isn’t a heating element. He has a gas water heater.

It’s common for people to run out of hot water in winter but not in the summer. The cold water is colder.

The simple answer is to turn the temp up......

 

[BlueSkyHigh]

Yep. Missed that the first go-round.

 

[Mitchell-DIY-Guy]

Makes no [financial] sense to heat water with electricity when gas is available. A larger tank, or the existing set to a higher temp with a tempering valve can be the answer, provided that the gas water heater is working properly.

That unit from Rheem will certainly solve the problem--but at what cost? Their sales sheet shows that it "converts" a 40 gallon gas into a effective 50 gallon unit. What they seem to gloss over is the 7,200 watts of electricity it uses, and the need for a 30A double pole outlet to serve it. As @kiwi_outdoors this isn't trivial. Don't believe him? Ask an electrician to bring that power to where your gas water heater is located and report back. Basically, the Rheem is a "band aid"...like using a space heater in a cold room because your heating system wasn't designed properly.

Maybe the home should have had a 50 gallon gas water heater in the first place. Whether 40 gallon or 50 gallon, a gas water heater still has a 40,000 BTU burner. It just stores more hot water; which is exactly what the OP is needing. More. Hot. Water.

I'm fully aware that there are a number of you, plumbers and non-plumbers alike that prefer electric water heaters over gas. My thoughts are ONLY when natural gas (not propane) is available in the home. But, ask any real estate agent what they think of an "all electric home" in a community where there's homes with natural gas.

FWIW I don't bother fiddling around with the temperature on my gas hot water tank. It remains in the same position year round unless we go away for a spell, in which case it's set to VACATION setting. In the winter I may have to make the shower a little hotter than in the summer. The controls are done at the fixtures, not at the tank. No costly or complex plumbing with tempering valves, or add-ons to a water heater. I have a 50g. Larger homes on the same street have 75g units.

 

[Twowaxhack]

none of that matters in the context of the op’s original question and his proposed problem.

It will extend the hot water of his existing tank and it operates on electricity as requested.

It doesn’t take up much space and the plumbing is easy to install.

For all we know his power box is 6’ away and hes an electrician.

I’m not going to debate gas/electric tank heaters. There are pros and cons to each and it’s very situational.

The OP asked a simple question and I provided him with a simple answer. Yes, there is something made to accomplish your objective. It’s up to him to decide if it suits his needs.

 

[arctic bill]

I am an old plumber, back in the day we had what were called pre heater tanks. These were galvanized tank . the water flowed in to the pre heater tank right next to the huge furnaces that we used at that time, then it would go into the hot water tank ,
the pre heaters sucked up all of that excess heat that was in the boiler room.
So to answer the original question yes there is a thing that will pre heat the water in winter going into the hot water tank.

 

[Twowaxhack]

He could buy a tank water heater (any size) and a circulator pump. Then use existing tank to heat storage tank. No extra venting, no 240v required.

He could install a 120v electric in series

Remove the tank and install a tankless.

Leave the tank and install a tankless

Install a tempering tank

Install a tempering valve

Install a larger gas water heater

Space out out water demands
Low flow shower heads

He could heat some water on the stove and use a wet cloth to dip into it and wipe off.


Depends on how much money you want to spend, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, you get the idea.

Can anyone else come up with more options ? Move to another house ? Shower at a friends house ?

 

[MrInfoPhilly]

He could buy a tank water heater (any size) and a circulator pump. Then use existing tank to heat storage tank. No extra venting, no 240v required.

He could install a 120v electric in series

Remove the tank and install a tankless.

Leave the tank and install a tankless

Install a tempering tank

Install a tempering valve

Install a larger gas water heater

Space out out water demands
Low flow shower heads

He could heat some water on the stove and use a wet cloth to dip into it and wipe off.


Depends on how much money you want to spend, etc, etc, etc, etc, etc, you get the idea.

Can anyone else come up with more options ? Move to another house ? Shower at a friends house ?

I'd tell him to turn the temperature up., and know that the hot water hot., so pay attention when you use the water., that's the best cheapest option. That's what i do in my house., and I never run out of hot water lol. I normally hear from visiter's in the winter, your water hot as F. Yeah, but I don't run out lol... I turns it down in the warmer months. Turn it up in the winter. My 8 year old son smart enough to temper the water from the faucet and tub lol.

 

[Twowaxhack]

I'd tell him to turn the temperature up., and know that the hot water hot., so pay attention when you use the water., that's the best cheapest option. That's what i do in my house., and I never run out of hot water lol. I normally hear from visiter's in the winter, your water hot as F. Yeah, but I don't run out lol... I turns it down in the warmer months. Turn it up in the winter. My 8 year old son smart enough to temper the water from the faucet and tub lol.

Exactly, that’s I said in post number 9. Turn up the temp. That’s what I do too. I have temp limits on my shower valves.

 

[TomFOhio]

You got to be smarter than the shower faucet.

 

[Twowaxhack]

You got to be smarter than the shower faucet.

Or smart enough to take the first shower