Need advice

[Akuzia]

Hi I am looking for some advice on a new water heater. Currently I have a home that a full in law setup. We have total of 3.5 baths, two sets of washers, dishwashers, etc. when we built the house they installed two Navien 240’s propane water heaters that have had nothing but problems through the 9 years. I want to switch to something else but due to needing a bigger tank the price skyrockets. We have 4 adults and two kids in the household total. One of the Naviens is leaking so water is shut off to that unit and we are running on the one unit with no hot water issues. My options are to replace the two naviens with a newer version just one unit, replace the naviens with a 75 gallon direct vent propane water heater, or replace with a 75 gallon power vent tank. One Navien installed is around 3000, 75 gallon direct vent 5,000, and 75 gallon power vent 3,400. Replacing with two new tankless is 6300. So my question is what is my best option to have sufficient hot water and with less headaches than my current setup. I was loooking at tanks with a high fhr and fast recovery. I was told when you go to 75 gallon it goes into commercial vs residential pricing. Any help would be great. My plumber has done a lot of research I just want to ask what others think. Thanks for any feedback

 

[Macdawgg]

I'm in the market for an upgrade to a 8yr old Water heater and I've been doing my homework. My advice is to possibly go hybird because Tankless systems seem to have alot of electronic problems. Do a search with the BBB and you'll be surprised at the number of complaints against Navien. But that's just my two cents.

 

[GReynolds929]

Navien has an excellent warranty and tech support, they will only troubleshoot with a plumber while onsite though. We just had a 4 year old Navien with a leaking heat exchanger and they had a replacement shipped to our shop in less than two days for free under warranty.

 

[CT18]

I would go 75 gallon power vent. I put a 50 in my cousins house and they have same set up just one less adult and never had an issue.

 

[Mitchell-DIY-Guy]

I understand from my builder that tank water heaters larger than 50 will soon cease manufacture. Don’t know if it’s true or not...

You could cascade 2 x 40 gal units.

 

[SHEPLMBR]

I understand from my builder that tank water heaters larger than 50 will soon cease manufacture. Don’t know if it’s true or not...

You could cascade 2 x 40 gal units.

With the Naeca standards anything above a 50 electric was just about NILL. Now manufacturers have found ways to get a 66 and 80 to meet the NAECA requirements in a residential unit.

 

[Mitchell-DIY-Guy]

With the Naeca standards anything above a 50 electric was just about NILL. Now manufacturers have found ways to get a 66 and 80 to meet the NAECA requirements in a residential unit.

Yikes. That's all a homeowner needs is some WEIRD size tank that's a special order unit. Oh, sure--we'll have it by Dec 15. What the heck are they supposed to do about hot water until then?

When my new home (at the time) was built in 1992, it had a 50 gallon Powervent model. When I needed to replace it, I had NO CHOICE. Of course it was a weekend, the plumbing supply houses were closed, and only the big box stores were open. Only ONE of them had a 50 gallon Powervent in stock, and ONLY ONE of them. I ran right over. The second time it was replaced, wasn't so urgent. Powervents became more popular, but still not all that common. Bought a Rheem at a plumbing supply house.

I'd much rather have 2 x 40s than one 80 if I needed that much hot water.

 

[SHEPLMBR]

Yikes. That's all a homeowner needs is some WEIRD size tank that's a special order unit. Oh, sure--we'll have it by Dec 15. What the heck are they supposed to do about hot water until then?

When my new home (at the time) was built in 1992, it had a 50 gallon Powervent model. When I needed to replace it, I had NO CHOICE. Of course it was a weekend, the plumbing supply houses were closed, and only the big box stores were open. Only ONE of them had a 50 gallon Powervent in stock, and ONLY ONE of them. I ran right over. The second time it was replaced, wasn't so urgent. Powervents became more popular, but still not all that common. Bought a Rheem at a plumbing supply house.

I'd much rather have 2 x 40s than one 80 if I needed that much hot water.

They are common here. Up to 75 gallon (power vents). Especially LP. We have an LP company that buys them regularly. And now that bigger sizes than 50 electric is available, I have been selling them out of the wazoo.

 

[Mitchell-DIY-Guy]

They are common here.

I did not believe what you said. So, I checked the inventory at The Home Depot closest to you...

Exactly ONE 75g LP model in power vent listed, and precisely ONE in stock. Yes, that’s it. ONE.

To a DIY homeowner needing one on a weekend, inventory at the propane dealer is not comforting. To one needing LP, electric isn’t an option and vice versa.

I stand by my first post. I would rather have two more common sized water heaters cascaded than one difficult to find size...

 

[breplum]

I only do Naviens now after having been factory trained in many tankless brands.
The NPE 240A is a great unit and I have been so very happy with them (with the exception of two ingitor wire parts bad on new installs).
The units should cost about $1,500 plus tax and swapping out dosen't take that much time. It only takes one plumber plus help just to lift up on the wall.
Installation cost should not be as high as you were quoted at $3k each. And in fact even less for two installed at the same time.

 

[SHEPLMBR]

I did not believe what you said. So, I checked the inventory at The Home Depot closest to you...

Exactly ONE 75g LP model in power vent listed, and precisely ONE in stock. Yes, that’s it. ONE.

To a DIY homeowner needing one on a weekend, inventory at the propane dealer is not comforting. To one needing LP, electric isn’t an option and vice versa.

I stand by my first post. I would rather have two more common sized water heaters cascaded than one difficult to find size...

I sell wholesale all day long. Say what you want I know what goes out of my doors.

 

[Dovid Elliot Gross]

I sell wholesale all day long. Say what you want I know what goes out of my doors.

I don't think he's arguing with you about what may sell overall. His point is that if you need a replacement Right This Minute, and its a weekend, most dealers are closed, but you can go to a big box... in which case, if you want the future option of like for like, you want to purchase something the big box will carry.

I disagree, because you are probably not going to replace it until the warranty runs out (funny thing...), and who knows what will have changed by then.

For "security," I also like two small over one large. If you put in a good set of valves, you can bypass one that does, and still at least have half capacity. Plus the flexibility of a two stage heat level.

 

[Twowaxhack]

Navien has an excellent warranty and tech support, they will only troubleshoot with a plumber while onsite though. We just had a 4 year old Navien with a leaking heat exchanger and they had a replacement shipped to our shop in less than two days for free under warranty.

In my experience Navien was the worst tech support on any product I’ve ever installed.

They strung me and my customer out for almost 2 weeks and sent part after part that passed every check they threw at it but would still send parts.

After two weeks the idiot admits this model Navien “ has problems “ and there’s a known defect that will cause this issue.,

Screw them. They should’ve told me that when I gave them the model number.,


I’ve told the story on a different thread.

They’re absolutely ridiculous and very unprofessional.

They do not generate a case support file when a problem arises. So every time you call you have to give them all the information over again. Every time I called I had to speak to a different guy.,

Wait times 45 minutes and longer.

In the end the Navien was trashed and I installed a Rinnai. I have pics.....

I refuse to work on Navien. I tell my customers that in my professional opinion they do support their product.

 

[Twowaxhack]

The OP needs at minimum Two 50 gal tank water heaters or Two tankless heaters.

If I went tanklesss I’d go Rinnai. Basic units indoor or out.

If I went tank heater then I’d go gas and pipe them in a parallel configuration. I’d go Rheem.

I’d also consider lifetime warranty stainless steel electric tanks.

Simple is better.